A new online high school for gifted kids
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Page 114 had this to offer: Gifted students' intensity and sensitivity require a fourth C: Compassion. ore than someother students,gifted children need understanding and support as they work through the myriad issues related to their asynchronous development.
ReplyDeleteThe asynchronous development can create so much confusion and anger from adults. "How can you be so smart and so dumb, all at the same time?" In our society we tend to shame those who are not leveled in intelligence.
I think that the most important flow condition is commitment. I find grades highly interesting, and the emphasis that we put on grades. Pages 155 and 156 explain that we need to help students see how grades fit into their lifelong learning goals, instead of just right now. I feel there is too much emphasis on all A's all the time, which is a ridiculously high standard for every student to achieve all of the time. If C's are average, then B's are above average, and show that the student is being challenged with work that is not too hard or too easy. In fourth grade a B or C is not going to matter on college applications, and I see many of my GT students caught up in whether they made an A and how can they fix it instead of what did I learn or accomplish. I don't think flow can be achieved if the students are freaking out about grades.
ReplyDeleteOn page 114 it talks about the third prerequisite for creating flow, committment. "The student must believe that the learning tasks are important enough for them to invest their time and effort." I see this as early as 3rd grade and one of the most challenging things as a teacher is trying to make the required curriculum purposeful, engaging and interesting to our students. It is a fun task, but at times can be exhausting!
ReplyDeleteMy students are definitely challenged daily. The area in which I need to improve is commitment. In the area of commitment, I believe I assess and grade fairly and communicate the importance of grades. The classic question is always "How I am ever going to use Algebra in real life?" I would like to spend more time researching activities that would allow my students to choose a product and give them more control over the process. (pg 149)
ReplyDeleteI enjoyed the chapter on creating commitment with gifted students--particularly the section on helping children understand how grades relate to life goals. Our underachieving gifted students aren't typically motivated by grades, but they need to understand their importance. I liked the analogy of a salary and being paid for results and not effort. Since we grade our math homework on completion, I think we need to continue to stress the importance of accurate results and doing well for further life events. Students need to be trained to see the bigger picture.
ReplyDeleteIn response to c strickland:
ReplyDeleteI agree that we need to focus on more realistic applications and creating real-world projects. Now to just find the room in our scope and sequence. :)
On page 114 it states “The students must believe that the learning tasks are important enough for them to invest their time and effort” in order to create a flow of commitment. I’ve seen this in my own classroom where teachers I was trying to make the curriculum not only engaging, but meaningful to their everyday situations. This can be a wearing task, but if the children don’t see wear in ties into their lives or where I’m taking them they won’t be willing to commit to the task or tasks in the future using this concept or strategy.
ReplyDeleteIn response to both cstrickland and j kohler:
ReplyDeleteTime is on so valuable, but there are great resources at your finger tips on the portal. I never realized how much time and effort was put into integrating the curriculum into everyday situations until I was killing myself making lesson to do this when it was right there on my computer! I thank a wonderful friend for showing me this…Check it out!!
Being compassionate + having commitment + being compassionate + having commitment= learning of the gifted child Being compassionate…understanding their needs and wants…adjusting our way of always doing it to meet their way of learning. Having commitment…to strive to teach them…to spend the time to learn about there way of thinking. Compassion to love and understand the child and the commitment to teach them their way will support and encourage the WHOLE GT child!!
ReplyDeleteresponse: WonderWeiss said that commitment was most important to flow. She said 4th graders should not freak out about grades. Isn't that the truth?! We need to emphasize learning and growth and challenge, and deemphasize the grades.
ReplyDeleteChallenge is so important. One: if it is never experienced in school, then in college or real life, when it finally does occur, it can be devastating to anyone, esp. the sensitive GT student.Two: the book states if there isn't sufficient challenge, "learning becomes routine and boring...motivation may disappear." (p. 113-114)
ReplyDeleteto jkohler: Don't tell, but you may have to fudge! Do what is best for the kids, and make it sound like it fits. If there is an item in the curriculum that can be stretched--extended sounds better--you might have to, for the gifted, spend more time on the extension.
ReplyDeleteIn response to jkohler:
ReplyDeleteI agree with the part about relating grades to life and long term goals. That part also stuck out to me as I was reading the chapter. Thanks for reminding me.
As a science teacher, I believe that "Commitment" is extremely important when enhancing motivation. Students often wonder or ask why it is important for them to learn something. "I'm never going to use this later in life" they say. If they don't see the future benefit of knowing the material, then they won't apply themselves. Studying for the grade ends up giving short term results.
ReplyDeleteOn page 141 under the area of control, it talks about the stress trap. Just this past week I watched my PGP students stress over perfectionism. I can see how they need to be in control of everything. The students are sensitive to their surroundings and it does affect their learning. ...several of them withdrew after seeing what the other students did as projects. I can see as a teacher I need to help them learn to "deal" with their sensitivity. This book has made me take time to look at the students a little more closely.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Jkoler about commitment and using a salary as a way to motivate the students. At RCE we have a fifth grade teacher who is trying this with her students (most of whom are in the GT program) and it is working well. They see purpose and goals - it is interesting to have discussion with the students on why they make certain selections...they are very aware of how money works as a result. It will be interesting to see how the year plays out.
ReplyDeleteWonderweiss is so right about students being over stressed about grades. I agree that too many students focus on grades and not the experience. A goal for me is to model committment to my students...hopefully as a result they will respond.
ReplyDeleteI think that the control aspect of the flow chapter is the most important. On page 115 it state” In the academic realm, students reported flow most often when working on team projects.” I think this is the most important because I have observed that students, when allowed to select their own projects (usually from a long list of option in middle school) they are happier, work harder, are more creative and ask more questions as they progress through their work. They usually end up doing more work than the teacher would have required. They tend to think outside the box and I notice that they laugh more in class. It also makes the teacher work harder in some respects because the questions usually are much higher order questions from the students and we have to go “look up” answers to keep up with the kids.
ReplyDeleteCommitment: As a musician, I am well aware of the experience of flow.
ReplyDeleteDuring my high school and undergraduate years, those regular hours in the piano practice room simply sped by as I was engaged, creating, and refining. I knew that with sufficient time and effort I could produce a wonderful product that exists only in the moment. I believe that commitment is highly related to challenge. My instructors would present the challenges in the form of repertoire. Material too easy was seen as boring (however I did not know how to look past the ‘top layers.’) Material far above my level might be produced in a sloppy, incomplete way. I wouldn’t necessarily know that, unless I received feedback. The instructor was the key to catching and capturing my awareness of more depth or of ways to perfect. And so it is with us as teachers. We are the key. The student may be committed, but needs to be continually challenged in just the right degree.
In response to hassidg’s remarks on the importance of challenge: I completely agree. Furthermore, finding just the right parameter of challenge for the individual then becomes one of our challenges!
ReplyDeletePage 158 notes that teachers must model commitment if they want their students to be committed. I agree also with page 115 where stress is given on teachers' own continual learning and sharing with students the subsequent excitement. I think students pick up on that and are motivated intrinsically to learn. Parents' sharing their high expectations must probably contribute to frequent flow states in students (p. 116). I do think that flow states in students result from an internal locus of control and motivation to learn.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Hassidg (Nov 12, 12:06)on challenging students in order to avoid boredom and a lack of motivation. I personally think novelty is stimulating to dendrites, especially when content significantly connects to prior learning. Also, really new content slows down the brain in order to encode content to memory. Then additional content connects with it. I think analogies can be powerful to bring about a positive challenge for students to encode new learning.
ReplyDeleteNov 13, 1:22 rcelibrarian talks about page 141 and GT students' sensitivity and need for control. I went back to reread this because I have seen these characteristics peeking out from a child's facade that all is well, then the compulsion to...what? I like that GT teachers are there to help students deal with situations that upset them and trigger negative reactions.
ReplyDeleteI chose on page 114 the third prerequisite for flow, commitment. When I asked the students to write about why we are studying the revolution, I got very vague and shallow answers. This is probably why they have not made a commitment and we have not created flow. They just do not see the importance of studying Texas history,yet.
ReplyDeleteI agree with evessali when they speak of commitment as extremely important. I am exploring how to get my students to see the value of studying history. Anyone have some ideas?
ReplyDeleteOn "flow"--I see this often in my classes during lecture (which the author thinks is uncommon) when the students are learning to solve problems a different way than they have seen before called dimensional analysis. Challenge is there because most of them have not used this to solve problems, so the method must be taught and the students are using conceptual quantities that they are not familiar with (moles, etc.). Control is also present because they must prove their answers with work and use a particular algorithm to solve the problems. Sometimes there is more than one way to get the answer, but they must show all work to support the answer. Commitment is also there because students understand that this is the way we will solve all problems in chemistry, physics and beyond, so they realize that they need to master this skill. Commitment is the trickiest componenent, though, and I often get resistance because they can sometimes do the work in their heads or just on the calculator and can't justify their answers. They eventually come around and this is when I see "flow" as they are mastering the technique.
ReplyDeleteIn Chapt. 7 is says that "Commitment feeds a sense of responsibility, a discipline that is ego enhancing and rewarding." I believe this is a very important part to enable students to feel that what learning is really worth their time and efforts. It is difficult at times when teaching different concepts to get them to "buy in" that what you are teaching them is important and not just for testing purposes. I try to use real-life applications to hook them into learning the concepts we are going over. Teachers are a critical role in modeling this for their students and going through the thought process that it is important.
ReplyDeleteIn response to WonderWeiss and Melanie regarding some students’ overemphasis on grades: This is part of the educational awareness process for families. Many times great pressure is placed on these students, contributing to the perfectionism, etc. And, as has been mentioned, this is information needed by all teachers, some of whom may not be aware of the special needs of our gifted students.
ReplyDeleteResponse to rcelibrarian:
ReplyDeleteI agree with her comments re: PGP students' stress levels over perfectionism and their need for control with references on page 141. I see this situation with our GT students frequently both in their classrooms as well as in dealing with their responsibilities and projects re: the SPIRAL program. I observe that many of the students never feeling that they have "done their best" and never seem to be content or satisfied with their final products even when the products are excellent. Reading this chapter has reminded me of the need to work with GT students regarding their needs for perfectionism. I also observe signs, in many students, of their great sensitivity to their environment and their need for assistance in how to cope with that extreme sensitivity.
The past couple of weeks in the library, I've seen most of my 4th and 5th graders in groups or whole class for research projects. Most of the topics being researched were assigned by the teachers. The kids were just regurgitating information. None of the ones I talked to were the least bit interested in their topics. They had no control of what they were researching. I dug up some more interesting facts to try to get them hooked, but I felt like most of them were lost from the beginning. They just didn't care. It really made me think about control more when working with kids. It will require the teachers to let go a little more, but if the kids really want to learn about something, they will step it up and apply themselves just a little more. The events I've witnessed of late have definitely reinforced the statement on page 114 about too much external control. "If there's too much external control, the student may concentrate on doing the job to spec, never venturing outside the lines to set his learning in context or apply it to his real life."
ReplyDeleteFor me challenge is one of the most important states of flow. As stated on page 113; If there is insufficient challenge, the learner isn’t engaged; learning tasks become routine and boring. Motivation drops, and unless challenging work is substituted for repetition and rote memorization, the student’s motivation may disappear altogether. On the other hand, if the challenge is too great, the student may become frustrated, frightened, or demoralized and just give up. I have witnessed a student that was not challenged and caused disruptions and mayhem within the classroom, when give a book about snakes or space, he would gladly share his knowledge with anyone willing to listen. I have also witnessed GT students that have been challenged and were unsure of themselves and how to deal with the situation. I think I was as shocked as the student. I am really working hard to differentiate activities and tasks within my classroom in hopes of challenging ALL of my students.
ReplyDelete"Control is central to developing the student's belief in his ability to influence circumstances in his own life" (115). I can see that when students are given some control over their assignments/projects, their interest increases. Of course, it is important to still provide them with some structure and support so that they produce something that meets the expectations. That's one thing I have noticed. Sometimes my gifted students take off on a project and become so immersed in it that's it's hard to give them feedback. They often seem so tied up in their work that I feel like any constructive criticism I give them is taken personally. I think I need to do a better job of reminding them before they start that there will be checkpoints. That way the feedback is expected.
ReplyDeleteI have a similar experience as suellen m when it comes to flow. I often felt that same feeling when practicing the piano and when in the dance studio. I read in Chapter 7 that "students report that flow experiences are more common in extracurricular activities than in the classroom" (117). I was not a "gifted" student, but I definitely felt more flow experiences in my extracurriculars. I would like to be able to provide the 4 C's for my students so that they could experience flow in an academic setting, as well.
ReplyDeleteIn response to sasha luther: You mentioned the portal being a wonderful resource. I was wondering where the information resides on the portal about integrating the curriculum.
ReplyDeleteWith my GT classes throughout the years Challenge has been the item that must be achieved. For so many years they have been successful without much effort so they are not ready for a new challenge presented at the High School level where they have to really go out and do something other than pasting it together on the school bus on the way to school. If I am able to challenge them with the subject matter their motivation level goes up so much due to learning a new realm of research and ways of applying this to other sections of their educations. When there are connections made with other parts of their education or personal life, again, the motivation is highlighted. And I find the challenge of finding something new- outside the box- of the textbook and the set pre-ap curriculum - to spark their interest and to show them something new each day a challenge for me. Some of my students have lived in other parts of the world so they are fluent in other languages and they know more of some cultures than I do, but then when I can provide elaboration to that background knowledge, we all are motivated to learn more about the world. An example of this was with the Amazon rain forest. I show a clip of " Life along the Rio Negro" and there are peeper toads there. More than once students have told me that was a wild new thing, they have wanted to do research on it, and they have gotten their parents involved to find more information about them. By challenging them with new enriched materials can get them involved so fast that you wish you could manage it with every days lesson.
ReplyDeleteThe chapter about control as part of flow spoke to me. I think that students take so much more ownership when they perceive that they have some control over an activity or project. It does take a little more effort on my part, but I firmly believe in giving students 'structured choice.' (This also helps with MY need for some control--a win-win!) When I taught second grade, and the kids were supposed to do bird projects, I changed the assignment so that they could choose what they wanted to research. It was a lot more interesting for all of us, and I know I got better results than I would have if I'd made them stick to the district-selected topic.
ReplyDeleteFlow condition of choice: Control. I agree with the authors’ statement that the “goal of all teachers of the gifted should be to develop students’ autonomy in school and in life” (p. 133). It seems that giving GT students “a greater degree of control over their learning environment” (p. 133) will increase their chances of developing what I am going to call “productive/healthy control” as opposed to “unproductive/unhealthy control”. Hopefully, being given “choices” and opportunities to be in control their own learning would lead to some mistakes being made. I think that this is the best place for the GT student to make these mistakes. In this situation is the priceless opportunity to receive support and guidance from a teacher who understands giftedness. It seems that not developing “healthy control” in school or at a young age could lead to developing “unhealthy control”. Developing “unhealthy control” could potentially result in some of the following behaviors.
ReplyDeleteExamples:
1. The gifted person may choose to avoid challenging pursuits because they do not want to fail or to be viewed as a failure. (can’t find the page #)
2. They may continually end romantic relationships to avoid rejection or to avoid being “lonely” because “being lonely is different from being alone” (p. 161)…one chooses to be alone.
3. Suffer unnecessarily because “asking for help or special consideration is an admission of weakness” (p. 145).
I feel that commitment is very important (pg 156-57). I think that the student knows if you care peronally and academically. They can tell if you are committed to them and their success. I feel that if they have faith in you and your commitment to them then they will return that commitment. They will be more motivated to achieving success.
ReplyDeleteWithout commitment…where would we be? The first sentence beginning Chapter 10 (page 149) held very powerful words for me when it comes to motivating our gifted students. “Gifted students become committed to learning in school when they feel a sense of belonging and importance and are engaged in activities that hold meaning for them.” What else needs to be said? If we as educators want to witness and enhance the gifted student’s motivation then we too must have commitment and the joy of modeling such behavior both towards their personal and academic lives.
ReplyDeleteGO! melscales GO! Your comments posted on November 18, 2009 @ 5:57 PM are oh so true. I do wish regurgitating information was a thing of the past…unfortunately the type of “research” you described happens in places you would NEVER imagine. Recently, I had a fantastic opportunity to visit several school/academies for exceptionally gifted students. In one location there were upper elementary students doing research…and had been working on this project for 3 weeks when we spoke. The students did not select their topic to research nor did they have any idea at that time a product would be forth coming. Using the computers for research looks enticing…put not at the expense of having a student look up information… complete a form or worksheet… only to regurgitate… sounds like someone is ill…and having students lose their motivation to achieve is a "sickness" we as educators and parents must cure!
ReplyDeleteI believe that the flow condition of challenge is so critical for enhancing motivation. Although challenge can be a double-edged sword, page 119, I keep being reminded as I read this book of the many times that GT students are in situations in school where there is very little challenge offered to them, except for the time they are actually in our GT pullout programs. For a very bright child, it must be so very demotivating to seldom have academic challenge provided. I have been reminded of the necessity for differentiated curriculum, opportunites for acceleration as well as opportunities to be grouped with other GT students. Sometimes I feel that the GT students are truly "the forgotten children" in our school systems today. The attitude of so many is that these kids can provides themselves with what they need academically and that there are so many other students with greater needs. But my opinion is that there are many other students with different needs but not greater needs.
ReplyDeleteI so agree with Suellenm that teachers and their feedback is the key to propelling students along the road to a condition of flow. We have to be committed, just as the students need to be. We need to adjust the levels of challenge and control to keep the kids motivated and tuned in to guide them toward success. We can show compassion and let the kids know that we are advocates for them.
ReplyDeleteIn page 114 the third prerequisite for creating flow is Commitment " The students must believe that the learning tasks are important enough for them to invest their time and effort" We as a teacher need to have relevant lessons that are interesting to our students. Worksheets and idle work really does not help at all
ReplyDeleteI find that committment has to be present for students because when they "believe that the learning tasks are important enough for them they invest time" (114) especially since its important for them to take ownership of their learning but at their own pace. It is necessary for students to see the connections to real life because otherwise their learning will not have any meaning for them.
ReplyDeleteIn response to estrickland, I definately agree that learning needs to be applied to real life situtations so that they realize that the knowledge they have will be used or applied in many different ways once they step out the classroom door. Pointing out how mom or dad used reading, writing, science, math or history allows children to see concrete examples, therefore, I always discuss this with them during the lessons I give them in class.
ReplyDeleteresponding to tiggeronmars, I like the way the question was stated because I also believe that we need to model committment so the children see it from us first. I have always believed tha we cannot expect children to know what the expectations are if we don't model first. We cannot forget that we may be the only models they have sometimes.
ReplyDeleteresponding to sullem, I definately see this as nother important factor because when children turn in their work our feeback can help them to know their strengths and guide them in the areas they need more practice to make improvements. Even us want feedback when we are doing something and especially I know for me I always wanted to know what I got from the teacher when I was in elementary school so I knew what to do next. That I believed has not changed even today.
ReplyDeleteIn response to oliverl
ReplyDeleteI would love to have my Algebra students do more project based learning. However, the minor amount of training I've had in that area never has good projects for my subject. It's difficult for students to "discover" Algebra without being taught the basic principles and Algebra 1 is where they learn the basic principles.